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Question: Should breed rankings be re-calculated?
Yes
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Author Topic: POLL: Re-calculate breed rankings?  (Read 3935 times)
Shanthi
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« Reply #15 on: March 04, 2012, 10:26:01 AM »

And just for the hell of it, I did Nightfight too.
  • Fake Number: 14 races, 70 points
  • Enyo: 22 races, 190 points
  • Black Star: 23 races, 260 points
  • Nightlight: 11 races, 60 points
  • Ardiente: 18 races, 160 points
  • Hopes Flight: 16 races, 120 points
  • Jett Black: 10 races, 100 points
  • Key Biscuit: 17 races, 220 points
  • Night of Storms: 10 races, 160 points
  • Dazzling Night: 3 races, 10 points
  • Darknight: 18 races, 40 points
  • Thanatos: 7 races, 0 points
  • Shadow Play: 5 races, 10 points
  • Glow in the Dark: 10 races, 200 points
  • Black Heartbreak: 22 races, 250 points
  • Inheritance: 20 races, 150 points
  • Burn Notice: 10 races, 10 points
  • Sponsored: 23 races, 460 points
  • Fightin The Smoke: 21 races, 360 points
  • Nightlit Haze: 17 races, 180 points
  • Buenos Aires: 15 races, 50 points
  • Kentucky Wildcat: 17 races, 70 points
  • Girlfight: 3 races, 0 points
  • Shailaja: 7 races, 0 points

So he has 24 foals who've raced a total of 339 times and earned 3,200 points. This gives him an average of 9.43. So the breed rankings may have to be adjusted for stallions since they have way more babies. ;)
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Shanthi
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« Reply #16 on: March 04, 2012, 10:35:51 AM »

And for comparison, I did What's It Worth. (Not going to list out all the foals because he has a ton.) He has 125 foals with 3,306 counted races who earned 31,510 points, giving him an average of 9.53.

Highland Rogue has 74 foals with 1,453 races who earned 15,410 points. This gives him an average of 10.60.

So perhaps for studs the breed ranking breakdown would be something like:
0.0-3.0: Bronze
3.1-5.0: Silver
5.1-8.0: Gold
8.1+: Platinum

Right now studs only need 10 raced foals to qualify for gold/platinum (though obviously all 10 foals would need to be amazing to get there). Since this is going by races more than foals, perhaps the requirement could be 300 races for gold and 500 for platinum? (This is assuming that most horses can race 10 times a year and a semi-popular stud would get 300 races within his first couple crops hitting the track. It would take a bit longer to get to platinum, but that seems fair - a stud shouldn't earn platinum based on just one or two foal crops.)
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Shanthi
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« Reply #17 on: March 04, 2012, 11:34:21 AM »

So since this was actually pretty easy to tweak in the database with numbers, I now have exact comparisons if the above system were put in place. (I've only done studs so far.)

The following studs would go down in rank:
Silver -> Bronze:
Gallant Fox, Unbridled, Flash's Image, Closing Time, Hope To Succeed, Worth The Wait, Government Secret, Whirlaway, Brazen Remark, Heza Gallant Gent, Seattle Sorcerer, Magic Man, Backseat Driver, Oscillation, Black Gold, Captain Jack, Who Says, As You Wish

Gold -> Silver:
Candidate, Run For It, Black Legend

The following studs would go up in rank:
Bronze -> Silver:
Count Me In, Robin Hood, Sir Lancelot, MakeMineManhattan, King David, Revenge, West Wind, Wonder's Pride, Tryst of Fate, Prince of Wonder, Awesome Again, Almost Home, Gimme A Shot, Blue Ensign, Magic Glory, Gotta Go

Bronze -> Gold:
Beatyatoit

Silver -> Gold:
Cigar, Forget It, Turbo Tide, Resident Evil, Redwood Prince, Lucky Cigar, High On Love, Danzig, Silver Secrets, Conspiracy Theory, Romeo, Worth My While, Highland Magic, Foolhardy, The Black, Strike The Gold, Townsend Prince, Irish River, Highland Bandit, Bold Ruler, Lit de Justice, Jazz It Up, Highland Wizard

Gold -> Platinum:
Highland Rogue, What's It Worth

All other studs would have the same ranking they have now.
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Shanthi
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« Reply #18 on: March 04, 2012, 12:16:02 PM »

I've setup a new breed ranking page that would show the breakdown of the proposed new rankings.

http://www.finalfurlong.org/breedrankings_new.php

Feel free to comment/suggest/etc.
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CricketHill
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« Reply #19 on: March 04, 2012, 12:27:34 PM »


(Let's also assume that races at age 5 and up don't count in the average.)


I would request that we do include the 5yo season. I've had way too many that have perked up as old 4yos and 5yos. I think most people do tend to retire their ponies. Not including the 5yo season would disadvantage studs who do throws foals that mature late and favor those who mature early, since the 2yo season is counted when the late-bloomers are running too.
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Shanthi
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« Reply #20 on: March 04, 2012, 12:32:13 PM »

Not including the 5yo season would disadvantage studs who do throws foals that mature late and favor those who mature early, since the 2yo season is counted when the late-bloomers are running too.

Actually, it would do the opposite. I mean "not counting" the 5yo season in the number of races for averaging purposes.

So your horse is meh at 2, wins stakes at 3, 4, and 5. Say his total points (for all races) is 100, and he ran 30 times, 5 of which are at age 5.

Without counting the 5yo year, he would count as 100 points and 25 races for his parents' breed rankings (average 4.0).
With counting the 5yo year, he would count as 100 points and 30 races for his parents' breed rankings (average 3.3).

All the races would be counted for gathering points (so he'd get points for 5yo season), but then when counting the number of races to divide by, it would only count those from age 2-4. So the 5yo year would just increase the average value because the points would count but the number of races wouldn't.

If people want the 5yo year to count for number of races, that's fine too, but more horses are likely to be hasbeen at 5 than immature at 2 (I think).
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CricketHill
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« Reply #21 on: March 04, 2012, 12:34:03 PM »

Okay, that makes sense. My misunderstanding.

Do you think the mare cut-offs need to be tweaked? There are a lot of platinum/gold mares now.
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Shanthi
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« Reply #22 on: March 04, 2012, 12:36:42 PM »

Do you think the mare cut-offs need to be tweaked? There are a lot of platinum/gold mares now.

Probably. I'm happy to keep tweaking numbers (but am getting a bit math'd out at the moment).

Edit: I've tweaked the mare requirements a bit more, which puts them more in line with the current breakdown of mares in each breed ranking.
« Last Edit: March 04, 2012, 12:44:33 PM by Shanthi » Logged
imagine
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« Reply #23 on: March 04, 2012, 06:43:25 PM »

I think I like the new system, particularly that mares with only one runner now have a rank.
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Emma @ Generous Bloodstock
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Shanthi
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« Reply #24 on: March 04, 2012, 08:33:18 PM »

I think I like the new system, particularly that mares with only one runner now have a rank.

They always could, but with counting average points per race, mares with only one raced foal are more likely to get to at least Bronze ranking.

I'll leave the tentative new system up for a while and see if anyone else has comments/suggestions/objections. If not, though, we'll probably switch over. :)
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imagine
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« Reply #25 on: March 05, 2012, 10:18:29 AM »

Ah I see :)
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Emma @ Generous Bloodstock
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Shadowfax
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« Reply #26 on: March 05, 2012, 03:54:57 PM »

Will you split the list of ranked horses into Mares and Stallions? Might make it easier to read and note the best stallions if they're all together/
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imagine
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« Reply #27 on: March 05, 2012, 04:09:02 PM »

If you click on the link the third line of text is a series of filter links (just above the first table) and you can select mares/stallions/BM stallions only there :)
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Emma @ Generous Bloodstock
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Standing at stud in 2020:
ICh Blue Smoke
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NCh Lasting Spirit
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Shanthi
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« Reply #28 on: March 05, 2012, 04:38:43 PM »

You can also sort by various fields as well as filter. So you could see currently available stallions (Active Only link) sorted in descending order of points, or rank, or foals, etc.
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Shadowfax
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« Reply #29 on: March 05, 2012, 05:35:19 PM »

It was my mistake for not noticing it to start with.

It all seems to look good and work well in my opinion
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