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Final Furlong Forum  |  General  |  Questions  |  Topic: 2 yo's Colt v Fillies
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Integrity Racing
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« on: July 06, 2012, 04:51:30 PM »

Here I go rocking the boat so to speak.

I have a question about 2yo colts racing with 2 yo fillies. In real life this does not happen, fillies are not allowed to enter colt races and vice verse. At this age fillies just are not strong enough to compete with the colts, and very rarely will 3 yo fillies compete with the boys either, has to be an exceptional filly to do so. Granted through history there have been a few of those fillies, but not the norm.

OK sorry I digress, my question is was there a reason for mixed races at the 2 yo level? If so is there still a reason to have them mixed, or will you keep them separate in the rewrite?

Just asking this because of the realism of this game, I love it and the challenges that is gives us as breeders, owners and trainer.

Sorry if this has been addressed before I could find a post on it, and thank you in advance for your reply.

BTW I do love the game and like the Beta very much.
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« Reply #1 on: July 06, 2012, 05:26:46 PM »

The game is not meant to be 100% realistic. It involves a lot of different stats (including fillies generally having lower stats - relatively speaking - than colts, to account for the fact that fillies usually don't compete against colts and succeed).

I'm open to making, say, all non-stakes races gender specific for the rewrite, but aside from the "hey, they shouldn't be able to do that!" argument (which, obviously, doesn't hold true in the game - fillies aren't as handicapped as colts in FF as they tend to be in real life), I'm not sure why I would. Races that are gender-specific tend to be harder to fill (I frequently have to adjust conditions of a race that's only got a couple of FF-owned fillers in it to get the number of qualified entrants up...and that's just selecting by FF horses where the only criteria are age/gender/energy/win-based qualifications). So I'd be hesitant to radically overhaul the race schedule (which works, generally - occasionally a race day pops up that has duplicated conditions, or needs slight adjustment, but I haven't tweaked the race schedule in a major way in years).

Other members are welcome to weigh in.
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Integrity Racing
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« Reply #2 on: July 06, 2012, 05:39:20 PM »

OK thanks for the explanation. I was more curious than anything.
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« Reply #3 on: July 06, 2012, 10:53:04 PM »

I'm happy with mixed races as I think it's up to the individual stables to work out whether they run their fillies against colts or not. Certainly, here in the UK they can, and do, run against each other even 2yo. There are some races that are restricted to fillies only or some for fillies and colts (i.e. no geldings). If I remember rightly a 2yo filly called Superstar Leo won the grade 1 Nunthorpe Stakes against older horses (unlike the FF version it's an all aged race). Not sure now if it was the 90s or early 00s. 2yo colt Kingsgate Native did the same a few years back. I think it just depends on the individual horse (both in real life and FF) whether they're capable of mixing with the boys or not.
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« Reply #4 on: July 07, 2012, 01:06:07 AM »

That's a bit untrue to say that the fillies NEVER run against the colts as they sometimes do. The autumn carnival in Sydney have a couple of big 2yo races that are mixed. True, that some trainers won't run their girls against the boys, but it does happen
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« Reply #5 on: July 07, 2012, 03:20:01 AM »

They're also mixed all the time in Japan, South Africa, and a few other places in eastern Asia (India and Singapore are frequent, but don't quote me on that). It's really only America that seems to freak out over mixing genders. I think it was last year or the year before where a filly from...India? Won the Triple Crown and Triple Tiara out there.

And since horses are stat-based here and such, I really haven't noticed a difference between running my fillies/mares in gender-restricted races vs. open. If they suck, they suck, haha.
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« Reply #6 on: July 07, 2012, 04:20:53 AM »

Lol, I agree, if they suck it doesn't matter who they race with. Go back in history you will find a few fillies in the TC here. Look at Ruffian! And wasn't it just a few yrs ago a filly was in the top 3 of the KY derby?(or 1 of the 3)
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« Reply #7 on: July 07, 2012, 06:02:07 AM »

While I think this is a valid point, I think the race schedule is fine how it is. I appreciate the fact that FF fillies are stronger than fillies in real life, just because it makes having fillies less of a burden. When breeding, you don't say, "Darnit, another filly that won't win me any money." Fillies, though slightly more handicapped than colts, still have a good chance of beating out the boys. There are many mixed races between young horses in which the girls came out on top in this game.

I think this is a good thing to discuss, but I like it the way things are.  :)
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« Reply #8 on: July 07, 2012, 07:36:52 AM »

Actually in 2007 Rags To Riches won the Belmont Stakes.  In 2008 Eight Bells ran second in the Kentucky Derby and then broke both front ankles and was put down on the track. However both of them were 3 year old fillies, where I was pointing out 2 yo fillies.

I'm happy with the way the race schedule is now, I was just wondering how or why it was that way. and I tend to bring up controversial points. Always up for a friendly debate.
« Last Edit: July 07, 2012, 07:40:22 AM by Integrity Racing » Logged
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« Reply #9 on: July 07, 2012, 09:05:11 AM »

It was rags to riches I remember and I read about the other and saw clips, made me cry. I was just pointing out fillies can run with the boys :)
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« Reply #10 on: July 07, 2012, 02:04:05 PM »

I follow racing in the UK and, to a lesser extent, the US and have also followed racing in a few other countries. In general, while there are 2YO races open exclusively for fillies and occasionally there are a few races open exclusively for colts & geldings, the majority of 2YO races are open to both sexes, including Stakes races (one exception is the Breeders Cup where there are separate 2YO races for colts only and fillies only).

In this respect, I think that FF pretty much does follow real life and would like to see it remain this way.
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Lewis
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« Reply #11 on: July 07, 2012, 09:13:19 PM »

I personally for the most part keep my fillies out of the open races. Mostly because they have a hard enough time against there own gender, let alone the boys!

Really it's pretty realistic having mixed gender races, even for the 2yo's. Seems like it's only in the states where we're scared of running the girls against the boys, very common in other parts of the world.
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« Reply #12 on: July 07, 2012, 09:25:37 PM »

Point of fact, today I ran a filly in an open 2yo race she was the only filly and she was 2nd! And she really hasn't done a whole lot up to this point.:)
Maybe she enjoyed running with the boys! Lol
Or the boys were chasing her! ;D
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